You know, the unions obviously want to make sure that people are getting, you know, fair compensation.ĭAVIES: And construction unions in the United States do wield some clout. So there's, you know, there are those kinds of elements which also do play into the cost. And these large-scale utility projects - the transmission, the generation, you know, that's very different from if I put a solar panel on my roof. They're well-paying jobs which are, you know, tied to our unions. And, you know, there's also a lot of politics involved in that. So we're talking about tens of billions of dollars on new transmission lines, right? And so you're going to need more transmission lines.ĭAVIES: Right. To get it to the population centers, you're going to have to tie in more of that generation to the grid network. And part of the issue is that if you have these massive solar farms or wind farms in the desert or in more rural Midwest regions. These are typically those wooden poles that provide the wires to your house. One is transmission, which are the really tall towers, usually the lattice metal towers. So when we think of power lines - and a lot of people don't realize this - there are really sort of two categories. But then you've got to get it there, and that's where the transmission lines come in, right? So the idea is to generate a lot of power, clean energy in these concentrated wind farms and solar farms. It's an aerial shot that shows rows and rows of solar panels that extend all the way to the horizon. You know, there's a photo online that accompanies your story of a solar project in Wingate, Texas. And President Biden's vision really envisions huge economies of scale. The second other component, of course, is the electrification of transportation, which really heightens the need for this kind of development.ĭAVIES: Right. The idea is to reduce the use of fossil fuels and obviously the emissions and to have some impact in turning the tide on climate change. And you tie that together so that you can connect various states that don't have wind or solar power. So part of the idea is you build wind farms in the area where there's lots of wind. I sort of say it that way because, I mean, when we talk about the electric grid, it's actually multiple grids in states and regions, and they're not all connected. PENN: Well, there are a couple of things that are sort of targeted in this, and one of the big ones is to expand and integrate the components of the electric grid. What is his vision in using this infrastructure spending to replace coal and natural gas-powered plants? President Biden wants to move to renewable energy. Before coming to the Times in 2018, he covered utility and energy issues for nearly eight years at the Tampa Bay Times and then the Los Angeles Times.ĭAVIES: So let's get into this. Ivan Penn is a Los Angeles-based reporter covering alternative energy. Penn explores the issue in an article in Monday's newspaper. The outcome, he writes, could shape the course of climate change and determine how the United States copes with wildfires, heat waves and other extreme weather linked to global warming. Ivan Penn says the nation faces a once-in-a-generation choice over how to deliver energy to our homes, businesses and electric cars. While the Biden plan sees a massive national grid of power lines fueled by wind turbines and solar farms, others want a more local approach, with solar panels and batteries in homes and businesses. Our guest, New York Times reporter Ivan Penn, says a sharp debate has emerged over how to spend that money on electrical power generation and transmission. Biden reached with a bipartisan group of senators. One element of that plan is spending $73 billion on thousands of miles of new power lines, part of an infrastructure spending plan. President Biden says he wants to promote renewable energy and hopes to completely eliminate greenhouse gases from the production of electric power in the United States by 2035. I'm Dave Davies, in today for Terry Gross.
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